Page 1 EXHIBIT A-87Page 2 HO-
Hinz, Jamie - Vol.
I.20210921.350687-HQ
9/10/2021 10:15 AM
Full-size Transcript
Prepared by:
HO-Tuesday, June 06, 2023Page 3
UNITED STATES SECURITIES AND EXCHANGE COMMISSION
In the Matter of:
)
)
BINANCE.US
File No. HO-13865-A
)
WITNESS:
Jamie Elizabeth Hinz
PAGES:
1 through
PLACE:
Securities and Exchange Commission
100 F Street, N.E.
Washington, D.C.
DATE:
Friday, September 10,
The above-entitled matter came on for hearing,
via WebEx, pursuant to notice, at 10:15 a.m.
Diversified Reporting Services, Inc.
(202) 467-
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQPage 4
they were in Singapore.
Q
And unofficially reported to you?
A
Yeah, I would say there were in Singapore or China.
Q
Okay, and what did they do?
A
They, they would help with, with working with the
products team.
There were some language barriers, so they
would help with the language barriers.
covering any issues in the Asia Time Zone while I was asleep.
They would do, you know, sort of the operational capacity in
They would help with
their time zone, so making sure that there were no bugs in
the, in the website and making sure that the products were
working and moving forward with projects.
Q
Do you remember any of the names of who those
people that were unofficially reporting to you in Asia?
A
It would have been Helen Zhu and someone named
Ruilin, but I can’t remember all of their names.
It was just
those two that like I said unofficially were working with me
on operations.
Q
Could you spell Helen’s last name?
A
Z-h-u.
Q
And could you spell Ruilin?
A
R-u-i-l-I-n.
Q
Can you recall Ruilin’s last name?
A
No, I think it starts with a Z.
Q
Okay, so those were two people based in Asia who
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQPage 5
worked for Binance.com who unofficially reported to you?
A
During the last several months of my employment,
Q
Okay, so just during the course of your employment
yes.
did you work with any developers or coders?
A
Yes.
Q
Okay, in what capacity?
A
I would participate in their product meetings and
engineering sprint meetings to help project manager the items
that they were working on, coding and help review some of the
designs of what they were building.
Q
worked on?
A
Can you name the product or the projects that you
There’s a lot, so I’ll name some of them.
I worked
on the Buy Crypto products, the one click buy/sell product.
I worked on the recurring buy product, and I worked on yeah,
other features that were, you know, improvements to the
website, adding debit cards and adding OTC desk, provided
general support to the engineers who were making the
products.
Q
Would some of the projects with the developers or
coders include staking?
A
Yes, yes, I worked on that.
Q
And was that staking for Binance.US?
A
Yes.
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQPage 6
Q
And did you help with staking with Binance.com?
A
No, I, I didn’t help in the launch of Binance.com’s
staking product.
Q
And so, who employed the developers or coders that
you worked with for various projects?
A
Binance.com.
Q
Any other employers?
A
Not to my knowledge.
Q
Did you ever work with any developers or coders
with the website or app?
A
Yes.
Q
And who employed those coders?
A
Binance.com.
Q
Okay, how often were you interacting with
developers or coders on these, these kinds of products,
projects?
A
Almost every day.
Q
Okay, through meetings?
A
Through meetings or messaging.
Q
And what do you mean by messaging?
A
Sending, you know, work communications over, over
messaging like through WebEx or Slacker, something like that.
Q
Or Telegram?
A
Or Telegram, yeah.
Q
So, messaging you’re just meaning sort of using
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQPage 7
sort of chat messaging services?
A
Yeah.
Q
Okay, besides developers and coders were there any
contractors that you worked with at, regularly?
A
I don’t think so.
Q
Okay, and you’d mentioned that you worked regularly
with vendors, is that correct?
A
Yes.
Q
Okay, are you counting Binance.com as a vendor?
A
That, that wasn’t what I was referring to when I
said that –-
Q
Okay, what were you referring to by vendors?
A
Companies like Prime Trust, or –-
Q
Any others?
A
-- would be another, or like Chainalysis.
Q
Did you ever work with Silver Bank?
A
Yeah, I, I would have worked with Silvergate Bank
if that’s what you meant.
Q
Yes, Silvergate Bank, thank you for clarifying.
Any other vendors?
A
Not that I can remember, those are the main ones.
Q
And what kind of projects would you work on with
some of these vendors?
A
Making sure that their service that they were
providing us was working well.
And then helping to build
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQPage 8
Brian’s review.
first few weeks of helping out with getting out of the
corporate onboarding queue I didn’t participate in the, you
know, never did the compliance reviews or anything like that
because I was not part of the compliance team.
Q
But no, I didn’t, you know, beyond that
Now, you said you originally expected though to
work on compliance is that, is that correct?
A
I was really hired by Catherine Coley to be a, be
her, you know, operations kind of right hand man.
So, I
don’t have a background in compliance and no, I did not
expect to be working on compliance reviews.
that that was part of the title that I agreed to when I
joined.
Although I know
That wasn’t like my understanding with Coley.
Q
And what part of your background does relate to
operations?
A
My consulting background.
So, helping, you know,
clients at Eli, figure out their operations both to be, you
know, to be an efficiently operating company and figure out
the operations in order to, to stand up some type of crypto
product.
Q
Okay, so going back to these accounts could you
just create more than one?
A
No, my understanding was that you, you could not
create more than one account because it would have been tied
to your Social Security number.
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQPage 9
Q
But what about if an individual was also affiliated
with like a corporation?
helped open a corporation account, could that individual also
have an individual account?
A
So, they individual might have
It would depend on what name was used for the
corporation, you know, depending on, on what name would be
used in the corporation I guess.
Q
So, it sounded like it could be very strict then,
you know, you couldn’t have John Smith open a corporate
account and then John Smith, the same John Smith try to open
an individual account, is that correct?
A
Yes, that’s, that was my understanding.
Q
Okay, and what were the ways, different ways of
accessing a Binance.US account?
A
You could use the mobile app, you could use the
website or you could use the API.
Q
Any others?
A
No, not that I can think of, no.
Q
Let’s see, how was account holder information
stored?
A
It was stored in an internal database, and some
information would be held at Prime Trust.
Q
You know, unfortunately for me the audio cut out
for the first part of your answer; if you could repeat that
please?
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQPage 10
A
Customer information was stored in an internal
database, and there would have also been customer information
at Prime Trust for level three customers.
Q
Okay, were they stored in any other way?
A
No, not to my knowledge.
Q
Could you elaborate more on what you mean by this
internal database?
A
When users signed up for an account that
information was sent to vendors, so sent to, through Gmail
for verification or sent through Identity Mind for
verification.
from the website was also feeding into an internal database.
And then information from those systems and
Q
Do you have a name?
A
Some people called it PNK admin.
Q
Did you call it that?
A
Sometimes I just called it the back end, but yeah,
I would have called it PNK for short.
Q
Okay, and where was the PNK stored?
A
On an Amazon Web Services service.
Q
Was that a service that you would have worked with
in your role in operations?
A
I didn’t set up the, the database management or
the, the cloud management so no.
Q
Who did?
A
I’m not sure.
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQ
PDF Page 1
PlainSite Cover Page
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Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 1 of 10
EXHIBIT A-87
PDF Page 3
Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 2 of 10
HO-13865
Hinz, Jamie - Vol.
I.20210921.350687-HQ
9/10/2021 10:15 AM
Full-size Transcript
Prepared by:
HO-13865
Tuesday, June 06, 2023
PDF Page 4
Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 3 of 10
1
1
UNITED STATES SECURITIES AND EXCHANGE COMMISSION
2
3
In the Matter of:
4
5
)
)
BINANCE.US
File No. HO-13865-A
)
6
7
WITNESS:
Jamie Elizabeth Hinz
8
PAGES:
1 through 184
9
PLACE:
Securities and Exchange Commission
10
100 F Street, N.E.
11
Washington, D.C. 20549
12
DATE:
Friday, September 10, 2021
13
14
15
The above-entitled matter came on for hearing,
via WebEx, pursuant to notice, at 10:15 a.m.
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
Diversified Reporting Services, Inc.
(202) 467-9200
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQ
PDF Page 5
Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 4 of 10
44
1
they were in Singapore.
2
Q
And unofficially reported to you?
3
A
Yeah, I would say there were in Singapore or China.
4
Q
Okay, and what did they do?
5
A
They, they would help with, with working with the
6
products team.
There were some language barriers, so they
7
would help with the language barriers.
8
covering any issues in the Asia Time Zone while I was asleep.
9
They would do, you know, sort of the operational capacity in
They would help with
10
their time zone, so making sure that there were no bugs in
11
the, in the website and making sure that the products were
12
working and moving forward with projects.
13
14
15
Q
Do you remember any of the names of who those
people that were unofficially reporting to you in Asia?
A
It would have been Helen Zhu and someone named
16
Ruilin, but I can’t remember all of their names.
It was just
17
those two that like I said unofficially were working with me
18
on operations.
19
Q
Could you spell Helen’s last name?
20
A
Z-h-u.
21
Q
And could you spell Ruilin?
22
A
R-u-i-l-I-n.
23
Q
Can you recall Ruilin’s last name?
24
A
No, I think it starts with a Z.
25
Q
Okay, so those were two people based in Asia who
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQ
PDF Page 6
Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 5 of 10
45
1
worked for Binance.com who unofficially reported to you?
2
3
4
5
A
During the last several months of my employment,
Q
Okay, so just during the course of your employment
yes.
did you work with any developers or coders?
6
A
Yes.
7
Q
Okay, in what capacity?
8
A
I would participate in their product meetings and
9
engineering sprint meetings to help project manager the items
10
that they were working on, coding and help review some of the
11
designs of what they were building.
12
Q
13
worked on?
14
A
Can you name the product or the projects that you
There’s a lot, so I’ll name some of them.
I worked
15
on the Buy Crypto products, the one click buy/sell product.
16
I worked on the recurring buy product, and I worked on yeah,
17
other features that were, you know, improvements to the
18
website, adding debit cards and adding OTC desk, provided
19
general support to the engineers who were making the
20
products.
21
22
Q
Would some of the projects with the developers or
coders include staking?
23
A
Yes, yes, I worked on that.
24
Q
And was that staking for Binance.US?
25
A
Yes.
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Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 6 of 10
46
1
Q
And did you help with staking with Binance.com?
2
A
No, I, I didn’t help in the launch of Binance.com’s
3
4
5
staking product.
Q
And so, who employed the developers or coders that
you worked with for various projects?
6
A
Binance.com.
7
Q
Any other employers?
8
A
Not to my knowledge.
9
Q
Did you ever work with any developers or coders
10
with the website or app?
11
A
Yes.
12
Q
And who employed those coders?
13
A
Binance.com.
14
Q
Okay, how often were you interacting with
15
developers or coders on these, these kinds of products,
16
projects?
17
A
Almost every day.
18
Q
Okay, through meetings?
19
A
Through meetings or messaging.
20
Q
And what do you mean by messaging?
21
A
Sending, you know, work communications over, over
22
messaging like through WebEx or Slacker, something like that.
23
Q
Or Telegram?
24
A
Or Telegram, yeah.
25
Q
So, messaging you’re just meaning sort of using
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47
1
sort of chat messaging services?
2
A
Yeah.
3
Q
Okay, besides developers and coders were there any
4
contractors that you worked with at, regularly?
5
A
I don’t think so.
6
Q
Okay, and you’d mentioned that you worked regularly
7
with vendors, is that correct?
8
A
Yes.
9
Q
Okay, are you counting Binance.com as a vendor?
10
A
That, that wasn’t what I was referring to when I
11
said that –-
12
Q
Okay, what were you referring to by vendors?
13
A
Companies like Prime Trust, or –-
14
Q
Any others?
15
A
-- would be another, or like Chainalysis.
16
Q
Did you ever work with Silver Bank?
17
A
Yeah, I, I would have worked with Silvergate Bank
18
19
20
if that’s what you meant.
Q
Yes, Silvergate Bank, thank you for clarifying.
Any other vendors?
21
A
Not that I can remember, those are the main ones.
22
Q
And what kind of projects would you work on with
23
24
25
some of these vendors?
A
Making sure that their service that they were
providing us was working well.
And then helping to build
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79
1
Brian’s review.
2
first few weeks of helping out with getting out of the
3
corporate onboarding queue I didn’t participate in the, you
4
know, never did the compliance reviews or anything like that
5
because I was not part of the compliance team.
6
7
8
9
Q
But no, I didn’t, you know, beyond that
Now, you said you originally expected though to
work on compliance is that, is that correct?
A
I was really hired by Catherine Coley to be a, be
her, you know, operations kind of right hand man.
So, I
10
don’t have a background in compliance and no, I did not
11
expect to be working on compliance reviews.
12
that that was part of the title that I agreed to when I
13
joined.
Although I know
That wasn’t like my understanding with Coley.
14
Q
And what part of your background does relate to
15
operations?
16
A
My consulting background.
So, helping, you know,
17
clients at Eli, figure out their operations both to be, you
18
know, to be an efficiently operating company and figure out
19
the operations in order to, to stand up some type of crypto
20
product.
21
22
23
Q
Okay, so going back to these accounts could you
just create more than one?
A
No, my understanding was that you, you could not
24
create more than one account because it would have been tied
25
to your Social Security number.
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQ
PDF Page 10
Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 9 of 10
80
1
Q
But what about if an individual was also affiliated
2
with like a corporation?
3
helped open a corporation account, could that individual also
4
have an individual account?
5
A
So, they individual might have
It would depend on what name was used for the
6
corporation, you know, depending on, on what name would be
7
used in the corporation I guess.
8
9
Q
So, it sounded like it could be very strict then,
you know, you couldn’t have John Smith open a corporate
10
account and then John Smith, the same John Smith try to open
11
an individual account, is that correct?
12
A
Yes, that’s, that was my understanding.
13
Q
Okay, and what were the ways, different ways of
14
15
16
accessing a Binance.US account?
A
You could use the mobile app, you could use the
website or you could use the API.
17
Q
Any others?
18
A
No, not that I can think of, no.
19
Q
Let’s see, how was account holder information
20
21
22
23
stored?
A
It was stored in an internal database, and some
information would be held at Prime Trust.
Q
You know, unfortunately for me the audio cut out
24
for the first part of your answer; if you could repeat that
25
please?
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQ
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Case 1:23-cv-01599 Document 20-7 Filed 06/06/23 Page 10 of 10
81
1
A
Customer information was stored in an internal
2
database, and there would have also been customer information
3
at Prime Trust for level three customers.
4
Q
Okay, were they stored in any other way?
5
A
No, not to my knowledge.
6
Q
Could you elaborate more on what you mean by this
7
8
9
internal database?
A
When users signed up for an account that
information was sent to vendors, so sent to, through Gmail
10
for verification or sent through Identity Mind for
11
verification.
12
from the website was also feeding into an internal database.
And then information from those systems and
13
Q
Do you have a name?
14
A
Some people called it PNK admin.
15
Q
Did you call it that?
16
A
Sometimes I just called it the back end, but yeah,
17
I would have called it PNK for short.
18
Q
Okay, and where was the PNK stored?
19
A
On an Amazon Web Services service.
20
Q
Was that a service that you would have worked with
21
22
23
in your role in operations?
A
I didn’t set up the, the database management or
the, the cloud management so no.
24
Q
Who did?
25
A
I’m not sure.
[9/10/2021 10:15 AM] Hinz, Jamie - Vol. I.20210921.350687-HQ
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